Audio (Continued) from the Texas State Board of Education Science Hearing November 2008Somervell County Salon-Glen Rose, Rainbow, Nemo, Glass....Texas


Audio (Continued) from the Texas State Board of Education Science Hearing November 2008

29 December 2008 at 8:19:08 AM

Last post leading to more audio here. Readers of the site know that I have been listening to the very long board hearing from the BOE website and snipping into chunks. My intent when I started and it still is, is to understand both sides of the hot issue regarding some language deletions from the draft teks. Very rough transcription written while I was listening-listen yourself to find out the exact words. Also have no idea how to spell names from listening.

Richard Nevill. MP3- Exxon Research 30 years. Oppose requirements , how about *may*. Mouse is religious idea of intelligent design. Students s providing evidence no mouse id mouse jumps out, scenario. PS says My logical statement is to recognize evolution has some limitations. Teacher pass a list around with Piltdown man, etc from DI. Mouse now 10 feet tall, can jump to own conclusions. Students are not prepared to jump to their own conclusions. Wedge to get religion into classrooom. Surpirse ID to be presented but its limitations to be evaluated scientifically, that requirem;ent would be a great lesson in what science is all about. Lowe-polystrate fossils. You're a geologist. Can you explain how they can exist within geological columns. Geol Cols.- sequence of strata laid down . Fossils differ as one comes to younger rocks. If one fossil found through 20 feet of multi strata? Balin whale. Gradually accumultated geologic whale through 20 feet of geologic strata. Incorporated into strat standing up. Lowe can't answer that. Coal. Sanding tree fossilezd that run through individual layers of shale. Layind gown of sdeiment occurred under mild conditions. Continues to be covered and does not decay or turns into quartz. Lowe-if layers of coal take all that year to form. Plystrate not found in coal beds. Found in Swamps. Coal scenes themselves do not have. Plystrate found in shale. clay bed streams flowing.Not in the coal  beds themselves. Was it DI Hegels embroyos that discovered is false? Scientists with DI are not relevant. Yes, I agree with that. Not relevant because they don't offer any real evidence about weaknesses. They contend but what they propose has nothing to do with evolution. They would concede you are on strengths. No ma'm those so called scientiest are not published in any peer reviewed research. National Geographi retracted about archeo bird. Mercer. Academic freedom  HS science requirements. Academic freedom actively involved in science means having hte freedom to pursue their research. Baylor Dempskey. Was universit correct? Got in university via special grant, not a tenure-level professor. ID promoter. U finally squished him. We are legitimate research institution. Now he's a senior fellow at Discovery Institute. Purpose was to push ID undercover. Requirement that students also analyze ID. (could hear somebody say "I told you")

Rabbi Charlenetron Waller. MP3 Colleyville. 3rd grade class asked how long the days of creation are. PTA event passed out WWJD. Rainy day teacher told veggie tales bible story. May not have had any lawsuits but religion is present. Prefer to work it out with superintendent instead of lawsuits. McElroy-be careful of what you read in the newspaper. You won't find a single board member that has advocated teaching ID, creationism in science class.

Sale Patterson. MP3 Biology A&M. College Station. Private citizen. new science standards are closely aligned to college readiness standards from last year (vertical team) college and HS faculty from all over the state. 2nd draft particularly unfortunate, language crept in. Limitations. what is meant by this, no specific examples, what assessment items? currently unanswered questions? Limitations? Germ theory breatkthru but there are still unanswered questions, don't know about pathology, genomic- do realize that it's not a weakness or unanswered question. Cargill-look at earlier grades? focused mainly on HS, drafts since they lead to college. If student doesn't take arth and space science? Wanted to be careful we were not defining courses, but covering topics.

Sam Scarpino MP3 - San Marcos. No scientist calls himself an evolutionist, that's a term forced by creationist. McElroy-is evolutionary theory and law interchangable? Lowe-Borrell's Law of Probability. Specific people apply to a particular place. My group studies ebola in Africa. Applly evol theory and math to model vaccination theories. (board member says arrogant).

Nathaniel Johnson MP3. Sugarland UT Austin multimedia. Let Teas stand in the scientific community's consensus. Teach evolution fully without phony weaknesses.

Jonathan Seins MP3 Director of Leg Affairs, for Free Market Attorneys, consitutitonal issues. Continue s&w since it's a 20 year policy. Trying to take Texas in a drastically different direction. Only teach strengths amounts to censorship, stifles academic freedom. Lawsuits. we work in lawsuits. Never a lawsuit in 20 years. If opportunity ACLU would have done it. Edwards vs Aguillar. We do not imply that a leg could never require criticism of science.Lawsuit talk meant to intimidate teachers. TFN study says p 12. Biologology prof s&w exist in any theory. Dunbar-were valid basis to lawsuit, any impediment for attorneys paid on back end? If ACLU had an opportunity current policy in place. Not about what a teacher does TFN booklet? Lowe-science standards not based on a poll. Study is advocacy. Not a story it's a poll. Doesn't appear to be scientific study. Not a direction Texans want to go. Haven't been any challenges. Due to small group that wants to change the way we do things in Texas. You know your duty. Eliticism and arrogance, people ridiculed and laughed at. McElroy in the same way I cautioned others about hate, watch YOUR decorum. Mercer- on p 12 left off the next sentence. Exploits. Asking to change 210 years. believes board is changing it. Knight. TFN-talking as if they aren't here. Can they come up and address the survey now? no.

Terry Burke MP3. Exec ACLU. Kathy Miller already spoke McElroy-take as little time as you want to . 1999 Dover inspired by DI. No scientific debate. No place for creationism in science curriculum. Judge said it was a trojan horse for religon. McElroy- how can you say inspired by DI when Texas had this language before DI existed? 2 peaople on committee. Language is troublesome. To say language is from the DI doesn't compute. Poor reasoning. Lowe-nothing to do with the teaching of ID. Dunbar-better to determine via courts or a lab? how to teach? Courts have relied on listening to scientists. Knight were you here for 2000 discussion of evolution? No.

Henley-MP3 protocol to adopt and renew text

John Kingman MP3 Texas needs strong science, competitiveness change to achieve goal. Meddling in our standards by DI (Seattle). Exploiting evolution DI to make money on sales Stephen Myer, Raphy Scilkey (sp)weak standards.

Paul Murray MP3 geoscientist UTA private citizen and concerned science. IDEA science begins. Present works to other scientists. Peer review process is brutal. Only the seed of good science will remain. Published. Only accepted body of knowledge. Does not include an express land to go directly to children. ID people have not published in peer reviewed scientific journal. No experience. Ironic since criticism is main source of notorieity. Brign it on in proper form for proper debate. process is distinct and separate from scientific debate. Publications in other journals. Any example of peer-reviewed work that even remotely criticizes Dawrinism "Expelled" Big science somehow exlcuding these individuals. don't participate in the process, process has said your ideas aren't supported, try to do end runs around them. Any works that criticize evolution there are none that currently exist. William Demksy said to have a paper in process. Lowe-Garner has no work-didn't select him because of that. Scientist from my district . 1999 openly critical of evolution. Not talking about newspapers. Gailieo would nto have had peer reviewed -was not castigated by any scientists of his time but by religious leaders. (Clap from audience-McElroy says SIR YOU CAN LEAVE). Science has nothing to do with faith. Belief systems not observable or testable.

Jerry Brown MP3 - McElroy are scientific theory and law separate? I do not believe there is a hierarchy. Date to indicate students no competitive for last 20 years? Cargill-examples of how s&w weakens? Dunbar-want active open debate in the classroom about scientific findings.

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